1st Presidential Debate: Online Polls

September 30, 2004 Presidential Debate Network Polls

Fox News Network

Ironically no poll was displayed at FNC. The results of other network polls were displayed under the headline:

Both Campaigns Claim Win; Polls Favor Kerry

MSNBC

Who won the debate? * 748030 responses

Pres. Bush
31%

Sen. Kerry
69%

CBS

Who won the presidential debate?

John Kerry: 91.20%

President Bush: 7.96%

Neither man. It was a draw: 0.84%


ABC

Who Won? (Among Debate Viewers)

Kerry 45%
Bush 36
Tie 17

AOL:

Who won the debate?
John Kerry 55%
George Bush 45%

Did it change the candidate you support?
No: 72%
Yes, I now support Kerry: 19%
Yes, I now support Bush: 9%
Total Votes: 471,086

CNN:

Who do you think won the debate?

George W. Bush
12% 5542 votes

John Kerry
87% 40498 votes

Neither, it was a draw
2% 738 votes
Total: 46778 votes


USA Today

Regardless of which candidate you happen to support, who do you think did the better job in the debate: John Kerry or George W. Bush?

Kerry: 53%
Bush: 37
Neither: 1%
Both/equally: 8%
No opinion: 1%

George W. Bush: The Art of Ignorance

In George Bush's speech to a hand-picked crowd of GOP loyalists on Friday, he again disregarded everything John Kerry said in the debate and instead conjured up his own idea.

October 1,2004 Speech
Allentown, Pennsylvania

Bush: Last night, Senator Kerry only continued his pattern of confusing contradictions. After voting for the war, after saying my decision to remove Saddam Hussein from power was the right decision -- (applause) -- he now says it was all a mistake.

Here is what Kerry actually said at Friday's debate in his response to Jim Lehrers question: Are Americans now dying in Iraq for a mistake?

September 30,2004
1st Presidential Debate

Kerry: No, and they don't have to, providing we have the leadership that we put -- that I'm offering.

I believe that we have to win this.

The president and I have always agreed on that.

And from the beginning, I did vote to give the authority, because I thought Saddam Hussein was a threat, and I did accept that intelligence.

But I also laid out a very strict series of things we needed to do in order to proceed from a position of strength.

Then the president, in fact, promised them.

He went to Cincinnati and he gave a speech in which he said, "We will plan carefully. We will proceed cautiously. We will not make war inevitable. We will go with our allies."

He didn't do any of those things. They didn't do the planning.

They left the planning of the State Department in the State Department desks.

They avoided even the advice of their own general. General Shinsheki, the Army chief of staff, said you're going to need several hundred thousand troops. Instead of listening to him, they retired him.

The terrorism czar, who has worked for every president since Ronald Reagan, said, "Invading Iraq in response to 9/11 would be like Franklin Roosevelt invading Mexico in response to Pearl Harbor."

That's what we have here.

And what we need now is a president who understands how to bring these other countries together to recognize their stakes in this. They do have stakes in it. They've always had stakes in it.

The Arab countries have a stake in not having a civil war. The European countries have a stake in not having total disorder on their doorstep.

But this president hasn't even held the kind of statesman-like summits that pull people together and get them to invest in those states.

In fact, he's done the opposite. He pushed them away.

When the Secretary General Kofi Annan offered the United Nations, he said, "No, no, we'll go do this alone."

To save for Halliburton the spoils of the war, they actually issued a memorandum from the Defense Department saying, "If you weren't with us in the war, don't bother applying for any construction."

That's not a way to invite people.

Many people have said that George Bush looked like he was anywhere but the debate. I have to confess, I agree with them.

source: 9/30/04 Debate Transcript

CNN's "Undecided" Voter Turns Out To Be A GOP Operative

Yesterday, CNN's Bill Hemmer interviewed "undecided" voter, Edward Martos. Martos, which has been pointed out by many, is actually a GOP operative who is involved heavily with the University of Miami College Republicans' and who has served as the Assistant Editor in Chief of the College Republicans' newsletter. He is such an undecided voter that he actually helped draft the constitution of the University Of Miami College Republicans. Martos, of course, by all measure, is not an undecided voter, but CNN refuses to report that they were duped.

Martos made the statement below to CNN, descussing why he is an "undecided" voter.

"Well, they took the words out of my mouth, Tony and Vicky. I've got to say, though, that I think, first and foremost, from Bush I'm looking for him to explain, you know, that he understands some of the things he did wrong, that he is going to take an approach that is slightly different from what he has been doing. At the same time, though, I think the problems in foreign policy are so great that -- and he created them himself -- that he's the only one capable of solving the problem."

"From Kerry, I do want to see some precise answers. I want him to frame everything that he's been saying, provide some answers for accusations that he's been flip-flopping, and I want to see some tenacity. I want him to broaden the discussion away from Iraq. I want him to talk about issues like free trade area of the Americas and North Korea."

It is clear that GOP talking points are buried in his statement. ~Amadeus

Martos Involvement in University Of Miami College Republicans:

Committee membership: http://www.umcrnc.org/2003-11-20.html
Forum Participant: http://www.network54.com/Forum/thread?forumid=263401&messageid=1092424983&lp=1096653704
U of M Constitutional Review Committee: http://www.umcrnc.org/conmin3.html

GOP prompts it's members to vote for Bush in on-line polls after the debate

Yesterday I recieved a link from a local GOP activists prompting me to vote for Bush in various on-line network polls. At first I thought it was a joke and then I realized that the GOP already knows Bush is a joke which is why they need their minions to log on and stuff online polls. That aside, the link took me to the GOP website, whereas the message below was posted.

As for the statement that the Democratic Party sent out an email encouraging grassroots activists to participate in online polls, I recieved nothing of the sort. I am one of those grassroots activists that they are referring to and I didn't recieve this so-called email. I checked with several of my collegues, but they didn't recieve this so-called email either, nor was it posted on the DNC website.

If anyone has it, put it in comments. I am curious to see it. I will be contacting the GOP headquarters this morning to see if they can actually produce this email.

_____________________________________________________
Vote in Online Polls After the Debate

The Democratic Party recently sent out an email encouraging their grassroots activists to vote in online polls regarding the debate. Don't let them fix the results! Make sure your voice is heard!

Vote in Online Polls After the Debate

After the debate, visit national and local news sites to vote in online polls about the debates.

Sites With Active Polls

AOL
CBS News
CNN
MSNBC

Sites That Will Probably Have Polls

ABC News
Fox News
USA Today

http://gopteamleader.com/myissues/view_issue.asp?id=2322
______________________________________________________

Here is a response from one of the Bush supporters regarding the debate. It was posted on the same page as the above message:
______________________________________________________
homosexual4bush 10-1-2004 3:36:36 AM
Hey Kerry! Who cares if Bush lied about Iraq to get us into war. You have to lie to get anything done in the world today. 1000 dead isn't much, either. It's a small price to pay to insure that Saddam won't use those nuclear weapons he certainty had on us.
______________________________________________________

You gotta love the GOP. With people like this, it is any wonder why we have idiots like Bush running this country. ~Amadeus

The National Debt under President Bush and Republican controlled House and Senate

The Debt To the Penny For September 2004

Current Amount

09/29/2004 $7,351,891,818,581.47


Current
Month

09/28/2004 $7,354,347,561,874.48
09/27/2004 $7,349,252,011,039.25
09/24/2004 $7,348,056,713,762.44
09/23/2004 $7,348,106,263,348.33
09/22/2004 $7,355,549,381,552.24
09/21/2004 $7,355,728,967,314.85
09/20/2004 $7,352,526,313,993.80
09/17/2004 $7,351,169,914,999.47
09/16/2004 $7,347,867,800,168.01
09/15/2004 $7,353,679,708,420.92
09/14/2004 $7,372,477,498,441.96
09/13/2004 $7,371,695,470,163.46
09/10/2004 $7,372,572,002,165.04
09/09/2004 $7,375,299,845,541.56
09/08/2004 $7,376,457,871,529.81
09/07/2004 $7,368,363,360,008.57
09/03/2004 $7,366,776,167,570.79
09/02/2004 $7,365,716,545,609.45
09/01/2004 $7,354,611,427,274.47

http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opdpenny.htm

Top Ten Flip-flops of George W. Bush

Weapons of Mass Destruction
Announcing the invasion of Iraq on March 19, 2003, Mr. Bush said, "Intelligence gathered by this and other governments leaves no doubt that the Iraq regime continues to possess and conceal some of the most lethal weapons ever devised."

Two months into the war, on May 29, 2003, Mr. Bush said weapons of mass destruction had been found.

"We found the weapons of mass destruction. We found biological laboratories," Mr. Bush told Polish television. "For those who say we haven't found the banned manufacturing devices or banned weapons, they're wrong, we found them."

On Sept. 9, 2004, in Pennsylvania, Mr. Bush said: "I recognize we didn't find the stockpiles [of weapons] we all thought were there."

Nation Building and the War in Iraq

During the 2000 campaign, George W. Bush argued against nation building and foreign military entanglements. In the second presidential debate, he said: "I'm not so sure the role of the United States is to go around the world and say, 'This is the way it's got to be.'"

The United States is currently involved in nation building in Iraq on a scale unseen since the years immediately following World War II.

During the 2000 election, Mr. Bush called for U.S. troops to be withdrawn from the NATO peacekeeping mission in the Balkans. His administration now cites such missions as an example of how America must "stay the course."

Iraq and the Sept. 11 Attacks

In a press conference in September 2002, six months before the invasion of Iraq, President Bush said, "you can't distinguish between al Qaeda and Saddam when you talk about the war on terror... they're both equally as bad, and equally as evil, and equally as destructive."

In September of 2004, Mr. Bush said: "We've had no evidence that Saddam Hussein was involved with September 11th." Though he added that "there's no question that Saddam Hussein had al Qaeda ties," the statement seemingly belied earlier assertions that Saddam and al Qaeda were "equally bad."

The Sept. 11 commission found there was no evidence Saddam was linked to the 9/11 attacks, which killed nearly 3,000 people.

The Sept. 11 Commission

President Bush initially opposed the creation of an independent commission to investigate the Sept. 11 attacks. In May 2002, he said, "Since it deals with such sensitive information, in my judgment, it's best for the ongoing war against terror that the investigation be done in the intelligence committee."

Bowing to pressure from victims' families, Mr. Bush reversed his position. The following September, he backed an independent investigation.

Free Trade

During the 2000 presidential election, Mr. Bush championed free trade. Then, eyeing campaign concerns that allowed him to win West Virginia, he imposed 30 percent tariffs on foreign steel products from Europe and other nations in March 2002.

Twenty-one months later, Mr. Bush changed his mind and rescinded the steel tariffs. Choosing to stand on social issues instead of tariffs in steel country - Ohio, Pennsylvania and West Virginia - the Bush campaign decided it could afford to upset the steel industry rather than further estrange old alliances.

Homeland Security Department

President Bush initially opposed creating a new Department of Homeland Security. He wanted Tom Ridge, now the secretary of Homeland Security, to remain an adviser.

Mr. Bush reversed himself and backed the largest expansion of the federal government since the creation of the Defense Department in 1949.

Same-Sex Marriage

During the 2000 campaign, Mr. Bush said he was against federal intervention regarding the issue of same-sex marriage. In an interview with CNN's Larry King, he said, states "can do what they want to do" on the issue. Vice President Cheney took the same stance.

Four year later, this past February, Mr. Bush announced his support for an amendment to the Constitution that defines marriage as being exclusively between men and women. The amendment would forbid states from doing "what they want to do" on same-sex marriage.

Citing recent decisions by "activist judges" in states like Massachusetts, Mr. Bush defended his reversal. Critics point out that well before the 2000 presidential race, a judge in Hawaii ruled in December 1996 that there was no compelling reason for withholding marriage from same-sex couples.

Winning the War on Terror

"I don't think you can win it," Mr. Bush said of the war on terror in August. In an interview on NBC's "Today" show, he said, "I think you can create conditions so that . . . those who use terror as a tool are less acceptable in parts of the world."

Before the month closed, Mr. Bush reversed himself at the American Legion national convention in Nashville. He said: "We meet today in a time of war for our country, a war we did not start yet one that we will win." He later added, "we are winning, and we will win."

Campaign Finance Reform

President Bush was initially against the McCain-Feingold campaign finance reform bill. He opposed any soft-money limits on individuals to national parties.

But Mr. Bush later signed McCain-Feingold into law. The law, named for Senate sponsors John McCain, R-Ariz., and Russell Feingold, D-Wis., barred both national parties from collecting soft money from individuals.

During the 2000 race, Mr. Bush showed support for the so-called 527 groups' right to air advertising.

In March 2000, he told CBS News' "Face the Nation," "There have been ads, independent expenditures, that are saying bad things about me. I don't particularly care when they do, but that's what freedom of speech is all about."

In late August of this year, in an effort to distance himself from controversial anti-Kerry ads by the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, Mr. Bush reversed his position, announcing he would join McCain in legal action to stop these "shadowy" organizations.

Though it would close the Swift Boat group's funding, court action would also silence well-funded liberal 527 organizations like MoveOn.org and America Coming Together.

Gas Prices

Mr. Bush was critical of Al Gore in the 2000 campaign for being part of "the administration that's been in charge" while the "price of gasoline has gone steadily upward." In December 1999, in the first Republican primary debate, Mr. Bush said President Clinton "must jawbone OPEC members to lower prices."

As gas topped a record level of $50 a barrel this week, Mr. Bush has shown no propensity to personally pressure, or "jawbone," Mideast oil producers to increase output.

A spokesman for the president reportedly said in March that Mr. Bush will not personally lobby oil cartel leaders to change their minds.

By David Paul Kuhn
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